Media Centre not looking very useful in the UK

Media Center >> Media Centre not looking very useful in the UK

I've today just found out about it. Yes I know where have I been.... Anyway
I have been trying to find a pc based multimedia solution for my lounge for
quite some time. When I found about about Microsofts software I thought
great and was quite e****d! But on reading about it further I am now seeing
the disadvantages and limitations:

Recorded video cannot be edited
No DVB programme guide support for satellite recievers and cards
It records in DVR-MS format which is incompatible with all other formats
Freeview not supported
Radio does not support RDS as far as I can see, which would be very useful
for station naming
No support for DAB radio
Copyright protection restictions when viewing material on a different pc to
the one it was recorded on
Thats just for starters... in all it seems inflexible and controlled.

All I want to do is have a PC which will do the job of a DVD recorder and
will be capable of pausing live TV and editing it before burning to DVD. I
also want to be able to extract the audio stream of the recorded video and
save it to MP3. Surely a machine can be built (be anyone) that will be up to
the job?

Are there any capture cards and TV out cards that give a TV picture as good
as a dedicated DVD recorder will give? Any good software anybody can
recommend? I would like to know your thoughts as maybe I am wrong about
this.

Media Player138

Media Center >> Media Centre not looking very useful in the UK

>Recorded video cannot be edited

Yes it can but you need a 3rd party application either freeware e.g. DVRedit
from www.thegreenbutton.com or paid for e.g. Sonic MyDVD

>It records in DVR-MS format which is incompatible with all other formats

DVR-MS is supported by many DVD authoring packages e.g. Sonic MyDVD ArcSoft
Showbiz etc. DVR-MS is only MPEG2 with a wrapper of metadata around it. There
are applications to extract the raw MPEG file either freeware e.g. DVRedit from
www.thegreenbutton.com or paid for e.g. Sonic MyDVD

>Freeview not supported

Freeview _is_ supported but not by all MCE machines you have to choose either a
DVB-T (Freeview) tuner or an analogue one that can also take input from e.g. a
Sky digibox.

>All I want to do is have a PC which will do the job of a DVD recorder and
>will be capable of pausing live TV and editing it before burning to DVD. I
>also want to be able to extract the audio stream of the recorded video and
>save it to MP3. Surely a machine can be built (be anyone) that will be up to
>the job?

There are plenty of alternatives to MCE if all you want is a PVR. Again there
are freeware applications e.g. http://www.gbpvr.com/ & apps for sale e.g. SageTV
& BeyondTV Check out www.shspvr.com/forum for much discussion on the Hauppauge
cards.

>Are there any capture cards and TV out cards that give a TV picture as good
>as a dedicated DVD recorder will give? Any good software anybody can
>recommend? I would like to know your thoughts as maybe I am wrong about
>this.

The capture cards are good but TV-out is pretty poor via s-video or composite
from any video card which is surprising considering that an Xbox that costs less
than a high-end video card gives much better picture quality when playing DVDs.
Of course if you have a modern plasma or projection & can use DVI or VGA then
the picture quality is very good.

--
Nigel Barker
Live from the sunny Cote d'Azur

Media Center >> Media Centre not looking very useful in the UK
Being really stupid here but i have a HP media centre high end and i
dont know what i need to buy to link it into my Sjy Digibox or where to
input a cable into the tower?

> *I've today just found out about it. Yes I know where have I been....
> Anyway
> I have been trying to find a pc based multimedia solution for my
> lounge for
> quite some time. When I found about about Microsofts software I
> thought
> great and was quite e****d! But on reading about it further I am now
> seeing
> the disadvantages and limitations:
>
> Recorded video cannot be edited
> No DVB programme guide support for satellite recievers and cards
> It records in DVR-MS format which is incompatible with all other
> formats
> Freeview not supported
> Radio does not support RDS as far as I can see, which would be very
> useful
> for station naming
> No support for DAB radio
> Copyright protection restictions when viewing material on a different
> pc to
> the one it was recorded on
> Thats just for starters... in all it seems inflexible and
> controlled.
>
> All I want to do is have a PC which will do the job of a DVD recorder
> and
> will be capable of pausing live TV and editing it before burning to
> DVD. I
> also want to be able to extract the audio stream of the recorded
> video and
> save it to MP3. Surely a machine can be built (be anyone) that will
> be up to
> the job?
>
> Are there any capture cards and TV out cards that give a TV picture
> as good
> as a dedicated DVD recorder will give? Any good software anybody can
> recommend? I would like to know your thoughts as maybe I am wrong
> about
> this. *

--
mattcross
------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.hide-link.com/
------------------------------------------------------------------------
View this thread: http://www.hide-link.com/

Media Center >> Media Centre not looking very useful in the UK Media Center is a bit like a chocolate teapot :-( at least outside the USA

Microsoft do not support DVB-S officially in either MCE 2005 or even Vista's
version of Media Center. Supposedly a presentation given by Microsoft at
WinHec 2006 would lead you to believe Microsoft ARE working on adding full
support for DVB-S (and DVB-S2 and DVB-C) and all the other many, MANY
essential standards needed by international customers which are currently
missing.

See
http://www.hide-link.com/
l
and also
http://www.hide-link.com/
d23cd/MED076a_WH06.ppt

Note: Despite the above PowerPoint file implying 2007 for these features
being added, there is NOT A CHANCE IN HELL that will happen. If we are very,
very lucky it might happen towards then end of 2008 at the earliest but
knowing Microsoft's track record 2009 or 2010! would not be unlikely.

Currently the only OFFICIAL way to connect to DVB-S (e.g. Sky), is to use an
analogue connection (e.g. S-Video) which results in 'glorious' analogue
definition and 'super high-quality' stereo, you also have to use the
Microsoft Infra-Red transmitter to change channels on the Sky box. As the
people most likely to buy Microsoft Media Center are those who have or will
buy a big flat screen HDTV and a 5.1 or even 7.1 surround sound system this
is hardly a sensible approach.

As people have (justifiably) got well and truly fed up waiting (and waiting
(and waiting (and waiting))) for Microsoft to address these issues, both
users and even third-party developers have come up with some 'hacks' to let
you get Digital TV (since Microsoft so far have proven incapable of doing it
themselves).

In the case of US cable, the 'hack' relies on the fact that the FCC (a
government body) has actually got legislation passed which is in the
interests of normal users [gasp!] This means cable set-top boxes are
required to have a FireWire (IEEE 1394) port for connection to a PC.

This hack is written by timmmoore see
http://www.hide-link.com/

Note: British and European governments are nowhere near as enlightened as
the US FCC so our cable set-top boxes (even if made by the same US
manufacturer, e.g. Scientific Atlanta) do not have FireWire connections.
Heck 'President' Blair can't even manage to operate an iPod! See
http://www.hide-link.com/

In the case of DVB-S or DVB-C, the 'hack' relies on tricking Media Center in
to thinking the DVB-S (or DVB-C) tuner (which is not supported by Media
Center) is actually a DVB-T tuner (which is).

See
http://www.hide-link.com/
ml
and also
http://www.hide-link.com/

Note: this hack means either you only get the same list of channels as you
would on DVB-T, or you have to manually map channels across and are unlikely
to get (or want) all the channels. You can however get pay channels this
way.

Now, if no-one else had managed the above, you might be able to forgive
Microsoft. The reality is that practically EVERYONE else HAS managed this
(e.g. MediaPortal, Myth, GB-PVR, etc.), even as shown above end-users
hacking Media Center itself. These guys [Microsoft] couldn't organise a
piss-up in a brewery!

Even the Mac using EyeTV can do DVB-S and DVB-C!

Perhaps, all the Microsoft developers are spending so much time blogging
that they don't have any time left for ACTUALLY WRITING SOFTWARE.

Never in the field of software development, has so little been produced by
so many for so long.
-- Apologies to Sir Winston Churchill [and brickbats to Microsoft]

Note: to correct Martin's original comments, Media Center does support DVB-T
(but not DVB-S or DVB-C). Media Center does support (now) radio over DVB-T
but does not support DAB radio or Mondail radio (both digital systems).
Media Center does support analogue FM radio but only if you use an analogue
TV tuner which means you cannot use DVB-T (or hacked DVB-S and DVB-C) at the
same time. Martin is correct that if you do use FM radio that Media Center
does not support RDS data (the iPod does as an example).

There are also a whole host of other things missing from Media Center (from
a UK and European point of view) that Martin did not list.

DVB subtitles
DVB teletext
CI (Common Interface) so as to support a CAM (Conditional Access Module) so
as to decrypt pay tv
MHEG5 Interactivity (the red button)
MPEG4 H.264 for live TV over DVB-T or DVB-S or DVB-S2
Ability to see/record more than one channel at the same time in a DVB
multiplex via a single tuner (for example EyeTV for Mac can do this, I can
watch say four different channels in the same multiplex at the same time via
a single tuner!), a similar feature for American systems is called
multifeeds which Media Center does not support either
etc.
etc.

>
> Being really stupid here but i have a HP media centre high end and i
> dont know what i need to buy to link it into my Sjy Digibox or where to
> input a cable into the tower?
>
>
>
>
>

>> *I've today just found out about it. Yes I know where have I been....
>> Anyway
>> I have been trying to find a pc based multimedia solution for my
>> lounge for
>> quite some time. When I found about about Microsofts software I
>> thought
>> great and was quite e****d! But on reading about it further I am now
>> seeing
>> the disadvantages and limitations:
>>
>> Recorded video cannot be edited
>> No DVB programme guide support for satellite recievers and cards
>> It records in DVR-MS format which is incompatible with all other
>> formats
>> Freeview not supported
>> Radio does not support RDS as far as I can see, which would be very
>> useful
>> for station naming
>> No support for DAB radio
>> Copyright protection restictions when viewing material on a different
>> pc to
>> the one it was recorded on
>> Thats just for starters... in all it seems inflexible and
>> controlled.
>>
>> All I want to do is have a PC which will do the job of a DVD recorder
>> and
>> will be capable of pausing live TV and editing it before burning to
>> DVD. I
>> also want to be able to extract the audio stream of the recorded
>> video and
>> save it to MP3. Surely a machine can be built (be anyone) that will
>> be up to
>> the job?
>>
>> Are there any capture cards and TV out cards that give a TV picture
>> as good
>> as a dedicated DVD recorder will give? Any good software anybody can
>> recommend? I would like to know your thoughts as maybe I am wrong
>> about
>> this. *
>
>
>
> --
> mattcross
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.hide-link.com/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> View this thread: http://www.hide-link.com/
>

Media Center >> Media Centre not looking very useful in the UK This thread is odd - but I find MCE OK in the UK.

You say it is not compatible with Freeview - but it is. I use it with
Freeview.

Via freeview, I can also receive digital radio.

I can edit the recordings via Dcut or Nero 7 and burn to a DVD using Nero 7.

Using Freeview, I have never, ever had any problems with DRM.

I have to say, for what you want, you are probably better off with a
dedicated DVD recorder with a hard disk. But you should be bale to make MCE
do what you want.

>
> Being really stupid here but i have a HP media centre high end and i
> dont know what i need to buy to link it into my Sjy Digibox or where to
> input a cable into the tower?
>
>
>
>
>

> > *I've today just found out about it. Yes I know where have I been....
> > Anyway
> > I have been trying to find a pc based multimedia solution for my
> > lounge for
> > quite some time. When I found about about Microsofts software I
> > thought
> > great and was quite e****d! But on reading about it further I am now
> > seeing
> > the disadvantages and limitations:
> >
> > Recorded video cannot be edited
> > No DVB programme guide support for satellite recievers and cards
> > It records in DVR-MS format which is incompatible with all other
> > formats
> > Freeview not supported
> > Radio does not support RDS as far as I can see, which would be very
> > useful
> > for station naming
> > No support for DAB radio
> > Copyright protection restictions when viewing material on a different
> > pc to
> > the one it was recorded on
> > Thats just for starters... in all it seems inflexible and
> > controlled.
> >
> > All I want to do is have a PC which will do the job of a DVD recorder
> > and
> > will be capable of pausing live TV and editing it before burning to
> > DVD. I
> > also want to be able to extract the audio stream of the recorded
> > video and
> > save it to MP3. Surely a machine can be built (be anyone) that will
> > be up to
> > the job?
> >
> > Are there any capture cards and TV out cards that give a TV picture
> > as good
> > as a dedicated DVD recorder will give? Any good software anybody can
> > recommend? I would like to know your thoughts as maybe I am wrong
> > about
> > this. *
>
>
>
> --
> mattcross
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.hide-link.com/
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> View this thread: http://www.hide-link.com/
>
>